How Miss Excel Made $100,000 in One Day Selling Courses on TikTok! w/ Kat Norton

[00:00:00.100] - Kat Norton
When I'm making content, the way I view it is content is an energy transmission. So you are making that person on the other side of the phone feel some type of way with your content. And that is what drives those quantitative KPIs that everyone's always talking about and measuring, oh, engagement and comments and likes and shares and followers. All of that is driven by the qualitative factors. And that is how you're making someone feel because if they don't feel something, they're not going to interact with your posts. So I put all my time, effort, and energy into cultivating my energy into a place that when it hits you on the other side of the phone, you got to watch.

[00:00:37.930] - Jesus Ramirez
Today's creator is Kat Norton, better known as Miss Excel. Kat is an online educator teaching Microsoft Excel. Her fun and engaging videos on TikTok have led her to reach almost 1 million followers. But even more impressive is her business sense. Kat has generated six figures in just one day by selling her Excel course on TikTok and other social media platforms. In today's episode, we'll dive deep into Kat's fascinating journey from her roots in the corporate world to her mediocre rice as Miss Excel and learn about her experiences in building a successful online training empire. Hi, Kat. How's it going? Thank you so much for joining me. 

[00:01:13.290] - Kat Norton
Hi. Thank you for having me. I'm so excited to be here. 

[00:01:14.150] - Jesus Ramirez
I'm very excited to have you for a lot of reasons, but one of the reasons is because you seem like such an energetic and outgoing person that I feel that this is going to be a great chat.

[00:01:24.270] - Kat Norton
Oh, yeah.

[00:01:25.100] - Jesus Ramirez
Can you let us know a little bit about yourself and who Miss Excel is?

[00:01:30.550] - Kat Norton
Yeah. So my name is Kat Norton, or a lot of people know me on social media as Miss Excel, where in a nutshell, I make Microsoft Excel fun. I create different training videos on the different Microsoft Office products, and I typically infuse them with music and dancing. And at this point, we're across all the social media platforms.

[00:01:51.970] - Jesus Ramirez
That's incredible. And you've blown up as an... Can I call you an Excel influencer?

[00:01:56.780] - Kat Norton
Yeah. It's a thing now.

[00:01:58.580] - Jesus Ramirez
It's a thing. Who would have thought? Let's start from the beginning. Before we get into all the amazing stuff that you've done, I want to just step back a little bit and talk a little bit about where did you grow up? What kid were you in school? How did you get into Excel?

[00:02:12.440] - Kat Norton
Yeah. I mean, so to take it way back, I grew up on Long Island in New York, and I was definitely a shy and quiet nerdy kid. I loved playing the Sims. I was just off in my own little world a lot of the time, which is funny because when I went into my MBA program, the professor was like, raise your hand if you liked playing the Sims or games like that growing up. And I was like, me. And he was like, you're probably really going to like Microsoft Excel because it's a similar thing. It's a simulation. So it all came full circle for me in that moment. But yeah, I was really just geeking out on computer techy type things. My dad gave me my first laptop when I was really little, and I would just hit the keys. I didn't know what I was doing. I would just tap on the keys. And I'll never forget, I used to get so mad if I hit the caps lock key because I didn't understand what was going on. I'm like, Why did all the letters change? And yeah, that was really more of the childhood.

[00:03:10.040] - Kat Norton
And then I went to school for business, got my MBA as well and that's really where my love of Excel first began was during the MBA program. And because every class I took was Excel-based, I didn't realize that when I signed up to be a data analytics major, and I ended up really falling in love with it throughout the way.

[00:03:27.930] - Jesus Ramirez
I'm assuming you had a regular job before you became this Excel influencer. So were you known as the person that everybody wanted to come over for Excel tips? Can you fix this for me?

[00:03:40.230] - Kat Norton
Yeah. So I started off at a consulting firm straight out of college called Protiviti, and I was doing securitization reviews for banks, which is as fun as it sounds. And on the side of my day job there, actually, because I was getting so many Excel questions when people realized I was good at it. They were bringing me on to different jobs to support people with it. I built out an Excel training course internally for the company because it was something I was really passionate about. I also studied teaching in school as well. So I would down the teaching and the business path. And I was like, this merges my two loves. And it's a way to help all these people at the company to be able to work faster and be more efficient. So I did that as well for four and a half years. I was traveling around the US hosting Excel trainings for the company, too.

[00:04:25.590] - Jesus Ramirez
So what took you from doing your regular job to I'm going to start posting TikToks about Excel because I think if I'm not mistaken, that's where you started, correct? Tiktok?

[00:04:33.830] - Kat Norton
Yes. So I started back in June of 2020. So to remind you a little bit, by March of 2020, I found myself back in my childhood bedroom of my parents' house, full time because before this, I'd never moved out. I was buried in student debt, and I was traveling every week for work. So Monday through Thursday or Monday through Friday, I was on the road. So I'm like, It doesn't make sense to even try to move out at this point. But with the start of the pandemic, I was really back in my childhood bedroom and I was like, I'm 27 years old. What do I actually want to do with my life? And I was trying to think of different things I could do with the Excel side hustle type of idea. I'm like, okay, maybe I could teach at different companies. Maybe I could build something out. And I'll never forget, I was on the phone with my best friend, and she goes, What if you put the Excel tips on TikTok? And I was like, TikTok? I'm 27 with a corporate job. I can't just make a TikTok. But my gut, intuitively, was like, Make this TikTok.

[00:05:34.580] - Kat Norton
So I'll never forget, I opened up the app, I didn't even have it on my phone, went to the app store, download it. Started looking around and I was searching Excel and no one was doing anything with Excel on TikTok. And I was like, That's weird. Do they just not like Excel on TikTok? Maybe it's the wrong audience or did I just think of something? And so I was like, All right, I'm going to do this secretly. I'll make this secret TikTok. And so I grabbed the handle, Miss Excel. I didn't tell anybody I was doing this besides my mother and my boyfriend. And each day I started silently just posting one video because when she said it to me, I had the vision of what it would look like. And I saw the Excel screen above my head and me dancing below it. And in this particular example, it was to that song, Tuesday slide by Drake, left foot up, right foot slide, to the left and the right function. So I was like, all right, I don't even know how to video edit. I'm going to watch some YouTube videos try to figure this thing out.

[00:06:30.920] - Kat Norton
And I literally googled, easiest video editor and taught myself really quickly and was like, Okay, here's how I could get the screen over my head. Let's see what it looks like and the video looked really cool. And I was like, Oh, maybe I'll actually post these. So I started posting one video a day, and by the fourth video, it gets 100,000 views and I was like oh. It starts getting pushed to all these people I know at work, I'm getting texts. I'm like, oh my gosh, help. And by the sixth video, the CEO of an IT company reaches out and is like, hey, I love your teaching style. I'm looking to create G Suite training videos. So the Google version of everything I was doing for students, parents, and teachers, because this is when the schools were starting to go digital with the pandemic and clearly, I'm a Microsoft gal but I was like, products are similar, I could learn those. So I taught myself that and proceeded to make videos and sell them back to the sky at night after my day job. And then I also was still cranking out the Miss Excel content too, because at that point it was lighting me up.

[00:07:33.960] - Kat Norton
I was having so much fun. So I was doing like 100 hours weeks for a minute there, just running all three. But the most of it, the front of it was actually still my day job. And that's really how it all started. And then after three weeks, I had my first video go viral. Looked at my phone, I had 100,000 followers on TikTok, and then I added in Instagram, and I just kept going viral across the platforms until it grew to over a million people across them.

[00:07:58.730] - Jesus Ramirez
That's incredible. There's so many threads I want to pull on there. The first one, though, is you said, Oh, my God, I'm 27 posting content on TikTok. I'm 40 posting content on TikTok, so it's okay if you're 27 posting content on TikTok. Number two is I had a similar experience where I was already big on YouTube but not on TikTok, and my fifth video got to a million views. And after that, I was like, oh my God, I got to keep posting on TikTok. And I've been feeding the beast ever since. And the question that I have for you is, how did you realize that the content you were creating was going to engage people, or you just threw stuff up against the wall and see what stuck?

[00:08:41.320] - Kat Norton
I really just had the vision of what it looked like and just ran with it. When she said it, I just saw it. I had never seen anybody do that before. An Excel screen above your head with you below it. When I point, the screen moves like having it all like... I just saw it and thought it would be a really cool way to learn. So I just went for it and it hit.

[00:09:03.560] - Jesus Ramirez
Have you changed the way you create content now as opposed to back then? I know the algorithms are changing. I'm assuming you have a lot more competition. I definitely have a lot more Photoshop competition on TikTok. So has your content evolved now to the next level?

[00:09:18.350] - Kat Norton
Yeah. So I do switch up. I have some talking videos now. It was so funny. People had never heard my voice for the first year. People thought I was British. All of a sudden I made a video. They were like, What? She's American? But yeah, I have some talking videos. I've done some full screen Excel videos. I just dabble with what feels right for the example and what would make it the clearest for people. But yeah, I just have fun with it. I'm always experimenting, trying new things.

[00:09:46.790] - Jesus Ramirez
Right. And I want to talk a little bit about the business side of it. Usually, I don't ask people specifics with revenue, but I've seen a lot of numbers in different podcasts you've been at. I think I've even seen an article by Forbes. I mean, you've been everywhere. And I was looking at something, and please correct me if I'm wrong, but I saw somewhere then in April of 2021 is when you had your first six figure month. That was two years ago. We're recording this in April. So two years ago, you had your first six figure month. And then in October 2021, you had your first $100,000 day. So two questions with that. Number one is how did that change your personal life? And number two, most importantly, probably, what business lessons did that teach you that you still apply to this day for the rest of your products and content?

[00:10:34.720] - Kat Norton
Totally. So, I mean, from a personal perspective, it helped me get out of my parents' house and my childhood bedroom because I grew this whole thing in a tiny, I think it was smaller than 12 by 12 room. I pushed all my furniture into a corner, I made a little studio and my boyfriend was living with us, too, at the time. So it was just a lot of stuff could work on. And so the first thing, it really helped us travel. So we became digital nomads for 16 months trying to figure out where we wanted to live. And then we ended up buying our dream home in Sedona, Arizona so that was a really cool, big part of actually getting revenue in with the business and the margins are insane. So we were able to just keep scaling it pretty easily because there's really no overhead costs. And then I ended up hiring a team too, which was really nice. We have a small but mighty team, the three of us, and that helped free up a lot more of my time because at first I was doing customer service for 15,000 students, and that became a lot because I answer every Excel question they have.

[00:11:39.560] - Kat Norton
So I ended up expanding the team, which was nice. And I mean, business lessons coming out of it, really, the biggest thing for me was learning how to sell. And luckily, my boyfriend was the number one ranked sales rep in North America at enterprise. So I got him to join my team. And we both been working together for over a year now. So he leads our corporate division. And he also taught me how to sell.

[00:12:02.400] - Jesus Ramirez
And what does that mean, taught me how to sell? What did you learn? Can you give me some specifics?

[00:12:06.610] - Kat Norton
Yeah. So I started doing webinars, and that is a really awesome way to sell courses. So basically I host a free Excel class. I give you a power pack 45 minute Excel class. People leave transformed. And then at the end, I'm like, Hey, if you want to keep learning with me, I give you an awesome deal on the courses. And that's typically where tons of people jump on. But I really learned how to speak and how to sell and how to do things in a way where it felt really authentic to me. And it didn't come off salesy. And so getting down that process because I've done over 50 webinars now. I started just really honing into my craft. And then the last six months, we've been really getting into more of tracking and automating and things like that to really just amp up the process, which has been cool. 

[00:12:56.580] - Jesus Ramirez
Yeah and it sounds like you do the live webinar. So it doesn't sound like you're doing the fake it, you know, it's not really live and people think that it is. So I'm glad to hear that you're doing it live because one of the things that I've heard you talk about, I think it was at another podcast or maybe one of the articles that you have been a part of, but it sounds like you view content creation as energy transmission and I heard a lot about your philosophy and a lot of these things, and I never really thought about it in that regard. But it makes so much sense. So can you talk a little bit about your philosophy and how that translate over into your work?

[00:13:34.960] - Kat Norton
Yeah. So I spend a lot of time working on myself because whenever I want the business to grow, I don't work on the business, I work on me. Because if I'm able to energetically hold the abundance and everything coming through, then the business is able to grow. Because, for example, oftentimes I go viral in the media. And what happens in those cases is I can energetically tell in my body when I am going viral in the media, I can tell when something's all of a sudden like, my eyes will start twitching, or my nervous system starts glitching out, or I start getting anxious because when there's millions of people pointing their attention on you, it starts to glitch out. And that's where I'm like, Okay, I need to meditate. I need to work on myself so I can grow to that next level and hold that. So every time that happens, I'm like, Yes, okay, we've reached a new level. I'm starting to glitch out here. And then I go in and work on myself. So I do a lot of yoga, meditation retreats, things like that to expand my energy so I can hold everything because my business has been a giant game for me to see what I can do, how many people I can help, and how easy the process actually can be.

[00:14:42.480] - Kat Norton
So for example, my whole business has been a series of inbound leads. So I've never had a PR person, I've never reached out for press, and I've been in 50 global news outlets from Forbes, entrepreneur magazine, all things. Same thing with corporate deals. And I just have all these businesses constantly reaching out and filling my inbox. And now we have my clothes and the deals. But it's one of those things where I came into the business being like, Okay, I'm just going to keep expanding myself and what I can energetically hold. And then that's how the business goes in and grows without me having that energy of reaching, like, I need, I need, I need. I removed that from the way I run the business so then that also ties into content. So when I'm making content, the way I view it is content is an energy transmission. So you are making that person on the other side of the phone feel some type of way with your content. And that is what drives those quantitative KPIs that everyone's always talking about and measuring, oh, engagement and comments and likes and shares and followers. All of that is driven by the qualitative factors.

[00:15:47.270] - Kat Norton
And that is how you're making someone feel. Because if they don't feel something, they're not going to interact with your posts. So I put all my time, effort, and energy into cultivating my energy into a place that when it hits you on the other side of the phone, you got to watch. I have a lot of people who don't use Excel who still watch my content because I do a lot of work behind the scenes to make myself come off like, radiant or magnetic or in a way where I'm just comfortable and authentic. And then that makes people want to watch because a lot of times if you're going through social media and someone looks uncomfortable or you want to tell, your subconscious can tell when something is wrong or if something is off. And it's not natural for most people to show up on camera feeling super authentic. You know what I mean? We all are. But then when you get on camera, a lot of times people are like, eek, myself included. So I've had to do a lot of work on myself to get myself to a place where I can show up the way I am now also on camera.

[00:16:41.500] - Jesus Ramirez
What does that type of work look like?

[00:16:43.990] - Kat Norton
Yeah. So I do specifically a lot of kundalini yoga meditation. So that's breath work, it's mantras, it's mudras. Because for me doing the whole like, Let's sit down, close our eyes and think about nothing, my brain is like, ding, ding, ding, ding, ding. I'm a type A person. So for me to get my brain clear is so hard. So for me, with kundalini yoga, you're saying a mantra. Your hands are in a certain way. Your gaze is in a certain position. Like when you're staring at the tip of the nose, it's activating your frontal lobe. It works at different parts of the brain. When you're saying the mantra, you're tapping the roof of your mouth that motivates different parts of your brain. So it's like this whole yogic science, essentially, that I started studying. And there are certain mantras and meditations for different things. So that's a way for my type A brain to hop offline and be like, All right, we're focusing on this. We're focusing on the tip of the nose. We're focusing on the movement. So that's something I do a lot. I also just make sure I'm doing things that I love before I record the content.

[00:17:43.440] - Kat Norton
I call this a mood boost, and it looks different for everybody, but for me, I love to dance. So I will blast some music, jump around, get movement through my body because that'll create more energy in the system. And for other people, it's walking outside, get grounded in nature, pet your dog, doing something right before you make the content or you have the appearance to give you that 10 % boost. Just topping yourself off, getting yourself to your spot where you're feeling so good because when you feel really good and you're projecting that, the person on the other side of the screen can't help but smile. And the best part is when you're teaching something and you can make somebody smile on the other side. That's really where they're getting a lot out of it. And they're zoned in, they're paying attention, and they're getting awesome content.

[00:18:31.240] - Jesus Ramirez
I a hundred agree with everything you said. The challenge for certain people like me who are natural state is down here. I am so calm and so relaxed and I'll record a video, do a TikTok, I'll watch it, and I'll get that feeling that you talked about, which is like, yeah, I look weird, I look uncomfortable, I need to go out. I live across the street from Starbucks. I can make coffee at home, but I'd rather walk across the street so I can put on some clothes, freshen up, feel good, talk to people and by the time I'm back and I redo it, I feel so much better. And I never put it into those specific words like you had never made that connotation. So I'm glad you brought it up because now I'm going to have to physically try to make that change prior to recording because it does make a difference. Another thing I want to say is I had a friend, her name is Kelly McCatharron, and she used to record basically what I did, Photoshop and Adobe tutorials for Adobe and other different places. And she always smiled when she recorded.

[00:19:28.270] - Jesus Ramirez
And even though I couldn't see her face on screen because it was a screen share, I knew she was smiling. And it's crazy how that translate over. Even if you can't see it, you can definitely feel it. So you're absolutely right about that.

[00:19:40.630] - Kat Norton
I was just about to say that was what I was going to say to you, make sure you're smiling. That's what I do, too. When I'm teaching, I do corporate Excel trainings for companies. And I'm always like, every 30 seconds, my brain goes, make sure you're smiling, make sure you're smiling. Because I am happy on the inside, but you got to make sure it's like, you know, like bringing that across. And when you're teaching something like Microsoft Excel, a lot of times people could get swept up in the weeds of it, or they might be overwhelmed over there. So if you have someone with a friendly smile looking at you in the camera and being like, It's okay, we're going to click cell A1. It definitely just changes the vibe.

[00:20:15.620] - Jesus Ramirez
A hundred percent. Are there any people that have come out and reached out to you and say, Hey, I'm an expert in blank. Can you help me become Mr. I don't know, weed wack or whatever. I don't know, farming or something, anything. Are people reaching out saying, How can I do what you do but for blank?

[00:20:34.960] - Kat Norton
Yeah, so much all the time, which is where I haven't officially started a business coaching practice. I've done it for my friends for fun over the years. Most of my friends, it's always this joke, if you hang out with me too much, you quit your day job because then they end up all losing their businesses. But what I decided to do, which I'm launching either in May or June, is creating a membership around this. And it's not just for entrepreneurs and people starting businesses.

[00:21:01.830] - Jesus Ramirez
On the coaching side, you mean not the Excel side?

[00:21:03.590] - Kat Norton
Yes. So this is a mindset membership because I've had so many people reach out, even people who aren't starting a business. If you're at your corporate job and you just want to feel better and feel happier in your day and be more optimized and learn. It's really just hacking your mind and learning these different techniques. That's something I've been talking about since day one when I started the business. Everyone's like, How did you do it? I'm like, I shifted my mindset. And even more so than Excel, I am passionate about this, and I've been just waiting for the right time to launch something. But I've been working on building out a platform with master classes where you meet with me live and all different really cool fun aspects and tools for people to shift their mindset wherever they're at. So that's something I'm going to be building out in the future to help people in that area because I get literally every day I'm getting emails from people being like, Your story was so inspiring. I want to do it for this. And I want to be able to help everybody on a bigger scale.

[00:22:00.070] - Jesus Ramirez
Can you share a story, maybe, of somebody that you've helped that reached a level of success that they weren't expecting?

[00:22:08.940] - Kat Norton
Totally. So literally just this weekend. So my best friend teaches yoga, and she had quit her corporate job and has been building out a business. And literally just the last three days, we came off a yoga retreat, and my boyfriend, Mike, and I just sat with her for three days building out sales funnels, webinar funnels, building out the site, building out the products, building out the sales pitch. We all just all hands on deck. And she's doing her first webinar on April 30th on meditation.

[00:22:35.180] - Kat Norton
I'm so excited. And yeah, it was just like the best feeling having her literally walk in with the ideas and leave with a well-oiled machine. And that's where I was like, dang, if I just did this for a living, too, I'd be able to have so many people. But I also still love my Excel business and I do a lot of corporate events and things that do take my time. So I want to do it all.

[00:23:01.320] - Jesus Ramirez
I totally get that. I totally get that. I didn't need to start a podcast, but I started a podcast. One of the things that I do is also I'm a finisher for the Hollywood industry. What that means is I create movie posters that you might see in the movie theater, or you might see on Netflix, the thumbnails and all that. I didn't need to do that. I'm fine with my training business. There's 30 things that I do, and I don't need to do any of them. Obviously, I need to do some of them to put food on the table, but I definitely don't need to do the 30 things that I'm doing. I just can't help myself. I'll hire more people to help me with this so I can have more time to work on that.

[00:23:36.730] - Kat Norton
Totally.

[00:23:37.240] - Jesus Ramirez
Where does that motivation and that passion to help others comes from? 

[00:23:43.360] - Kat Norton
I've been this way my whole life. An example that I always tell people, I was like a weird kid in middle school where if there was a test coming up, I would build out this beautiful, colorful study guide and then print out copies for everyone in the class and hand them out to all the other kids. I was always just trying to want to help people with this stuff and use my creativity and build resources for other people. And I thought back on that, I was like, dang, I guess I've always been like this. Here's the study guide. And people were like, what?

[00:24:14.540] - Jesus Ramirez
But that's great. It helped you learn. And they passed the test because of you. You know what happens to me? When I started teaching Photoshop, I started teaching Photoshop in 2011, and I actually became a much, much better Photoshop user than I already was because I realized that for me to easily explain something, I really needed to understand the concepts. I couldn't just wing it and say, oh, yeah, this works like this. No, I need you to know exactly how it worked so I can properly explain it in a simple manner. Did that happen to you that you're a much better Excel user now than you were in the past? 

[00:24:51.660] - Kat Norton
Totally, because a lot of it, too, grew through experience being in the consulting field. So when I was doing the securitizations reviews for five years, every week, I would fly to a different state, to a different company, and I would be in a different spreadsheet with a different business model. So I, every week, was seeing a new company spreadsheets. I was keeping pavs on what they're running into, where are the mess ups in their spreadsheets? My job was literally to review the mechanics of an Excel spreadsheet and make sure that they were correctly capturing the securitizations. And so I was just seeing all different types of companies from CLOs to I was out in Reno at a vending machine company, just all different types of companies. So really taking that into play and then figuring out how to best teach it. But having that experience was really where I was able to teach a skill. But then I can tell you, three different ways I've seen that you can apply it. And that's what gets the gears turning for people. That's where it's like, okay, she taught me how to do a Flash Fill, but oh, wait, here's where I can actually use the Flash Fill.

[00:25:53.640] - Kat Norton
And bridging that connection is such a big part of teaching versus just showing the mechanics of something. So that's really where my experience in that has helped. And then now, teaching at so many different Fortune 500 companies, I see all their different things, too. And they give me mock data to build custom trainings. So I'm able to keep seeing how different companies use the different products. 

[00:26:15.270] - Jesus Ramirez
Is that fun for you coming into a place and saying, Hey, check this out. Can you help us? And you're like, Yes, challenge accepted.

[00:26:22.190] - Kat Norton
Oh, yeah. I love doing Excel trainings live. We have 60 minute corporate sessions, and they're just a good time too. We make sure that they're fun, they're upbeat, we give them training workbooks to walk through, too. It's a really good experience. 

[00:26:36.670] - Jesus Ramirez
Do you do these on your own or do you have people working with you in these training experiences? 

[00:26:41.320] - Kat Norton
It's all me, they get me live on screen.

[00:26:43.420] - Jesus Ramirez
Oh, my God. That's amazing. And in terms of content creation now, if you were to start today, having your knowledge, would you do anything different? Or what would be different if you were to start out today? 

[00:26:56.980] - Kat Norton
I mean, at this point, I think it was all just my destiny path to do it the way that I did it. Obviously, the platforms have changed a little bit. I definitely now, after time, have more of an omnipresence approach. But I do think if I started off on six platforms, I would have gotten overwhelmed, like trying to keep up with all those. Now I've done all of them each day. So I just stuck with one until it went viral. Then I added in another and then another. Just did it more gradually because I really built the business around the lifestyle I wanted to have. I didn't want to build something that was going to drown me where I was going to be working 60 hours weeks again. I was like, I want to be doing something where I can live my life now and travel and do things and have fun. It's all about the journey. And so I didn't want to do something where I'd be completely buried. So that was one of my things in growing the actual business was I built it around the lifestyle I wanted. 

[00:27:50.400] - Jesus Ramirez
I think that's incredible because I feel that a lot of people are too much about the grind, maybe myself included. There's something about that, the grind that some people enjoy, which again, I'm a victim of this. And it's interesting to hear your perspective about putting your life first and not the grind. And I would assume that that has to do a lot of with the self reflection that you do, the meditation, all this stuff that I never do. So perhaps I need to start doing it.

[00:28:16.120] - Kat Norton
Totally. Because for me, too, the happier I am and the more energetically aligned I feel, that's when I'm getting the huge opportunities out of nowhere landing in my inbox. If I'm two heads down and I feel stressed, energetically, I'm at my capacity. My cup is full, new things don't come in. So I always work to leave that space. And then that's where I couldn't have even predicted how big the business was going to grow and how quickly. I can't even predict what it's going to do in the future because literally, an email tomorrow could shift the whole trajectory of it. And that's how it's grown. On basics on TikTok, did I expect the CEO of an IT company to reach out, give me a side hustle, then I start getting the income? Did I expect to go viral? Did I expect Microsoft to reach out for me to start working with them? It was all different things I couldn't have even predicted. So that's where I make sure I'm happy and I'm the best version of me to the best of my abilities. And that leaves the room for the magic to happen. The cool things, the things you can't predict or plan for.

[00:29:18.060] - Jesus Ramirez
How do you think you had the courage to take on these opportunities? I feel that a lot of people may hear that opportunity knocking on the door, but they don't answer the door. What led you to answer the door and say, Screw it, I'm going, I'm doing this. 

[00:29:31.530] - Kat Norton
So I mean, the way I view entrepreneurship is entrepreneurship is taking the bet on you. And if you sit down at the end of the day and you're like, I know that I will not stop. I will not give up until I get where I'm going, I'm confident saying yes to any deal because I know that if I will sit and put in the time and put in the effort, I know I'm smart enough to do it. It's really just a confidence game. It's really believing yourself because so many people just stand in their own way. And I was included in that. I was very shy, soft spoken. Even in the corporate space, I was a total perfectionist. I had imposter syndrome. I wouldn't raise my hand to answer something unless I knew without a shadow of a doubt that I was right. And that's really where now, the way the business grew so quickly was because I took messy action. Even in building my first course, I had that thing out in two weeks because I was like, you know what? Everyone wants this. I'm going to take two weeks off for my day job.

[00:30:28.410] - Kat Norton
Focus, focus, focus. Build this thing out and just trust. And then people loved it. And I was like, Wow, I'll do it again. I'm going to repeat it. I built out nine more courses over two months. And it was one of those things where it's really just coming down to believing in yourself. And then if you're feeling that there are limits in front of you that are stopping you from fully betting on you, that's where we get to shine a light on that blind spot and work through those limiting beliefs. And there are so many different tools out there from inner child work, subconscious reprogramming. I just did a lot of work on myself before I started the business, which I think made it easier because instead of standing in my own way like I normally would, I wasn't anymore. I'll never forget it was April of 2020. I didn't start my business till June. I came out of my childhood bedroom after doing these 20 minute meditations every day where I was going back to my inner child and reframing different events that happened that were currently playing out now because of the conditioning I had.

[00:31:26.320] - Kat Norton
And I was like, Mom, I'm going to be rich and famous soon, so I need you to prepare your nervous system for that.

[00:31:33.690] - Jesus Ramirez
Oh my god.

[00:31:35.040] - Kat Norton
And she was like, Kathleen, go clean your room. Just like what you're saying. But I was like, Mom, something big is about to happen. Then I went off into my room and then didn't even have a business idea yet. But just every cell in my body was prepared for something big. And then the second I tried, everything just started moving fast because I was no longer standing in my way. Another great example, I was scared of the ocean. I was scared of the ocean my whole life, would not swim. I wouldn't go in past my knees. I got tumbled once as a kid and was like, Oh, my gosh, the ocean is dangerous. I'm not going in there. I decide to book a surfing and yoga retreat in Morocco in 2019. And I'm like, You know what? I'm just going to overhaul my system. I'm just going to go and I'm going to get on a surfboard and I'm going to try. And I ended up loving it. And that's where I had a revelation. I was like, Oh, my gosh. I could have gone my whole life without going in the ocean because I didn't like the ocean, was scared of the ocean.

[00:32:30.510] - Kat Norton
And instead, I ripped the bandaid off, I pushed myself out of my comfort zone, and now I love it. And now I'm living in Laguna Beach and we go in the ocean. It's just like I could have wrecked that part of my life if I didn't actually challenge myself and have the notion that our limiting beliefs are all malleable. That's what a lot of people don't realize, too, is all our limiting beliefs in our conditioning is reprogrammable. We don't have to be like, I am the way I am for the rest of my life. It's not true. And I was shy with a massive anxiety disorder, and now I dance on TikTok for a living. There are tools out there that we can use to clear this stuff up and feel like our authentic selves. And I've never truly been happy until I did those things. I had happy moments, but I wasn't comfortable in my own skin until now. So I think that's just like, if anyone gets a message out of this who's feeling some type of way about themselves, just know that there are tools out there and it doesn't have to be that way.

[00:33:27.310] - Jesus Ramirez
A hundred percent. And I'm not going to go too deep into it, but everything you did describe, exactly my story as well. I was a little older than you, though. I was still 27 when I used to work at the mall. I didn't have a career. I didn't even have a car. And I remember that I live in the San Francisco Bay area and there's a train system called the BART, and I was riding the BART and I just remember leaning my head up against the window and I just felt so sad and so depressed. I'm like, I'm 27 years old working at the mall. What future do I have? And I had all these, as you mentioned, limiting beliefs that it wasn't going to happen. But at the same time in the back of my head, I also had that I know I have it in me to do something. And when I was about 32, I think is when I started doing what I'm doing now. Fast forward until now, and I have a YouTube channel with almost two million subscribers. I've spoken at over 30 conferences worldwide. Oh, my guess is the craziest thing.

[00:34:33.560] - Jesus Ramirez
I won one of the 40 under 40s. Obviously, there's 39 others. So 40 under 40 for my university, considering I had a 2.5 GPA in school. I was a terrible student, but it was all mindset. So I am 100 % with you on that whole mindset mentality. I used to be a very shy kid. Naturally, I'm still very shy, but I can shake it off if I need to go on stage. I also used to be a soccer coach. I played soccer in college. And then after college, I went and coached my high school team. And I used to be terrified at coaches and parent meetings when I had to speak to a room of 10 parents. I would shake and I would stutter and I would look down and I would just be so terrified. And now the biggest stage I've ever spoken in was probably about 5,000 people in Guadalajara, Mexico. So it's crazy how when you change your mindset, or you not even change your mindset, you decide that you're going to try, just try. Try to push a little bit. You'll be surprised as to how far you can push. 

[00:35:36.040] - Kat Norton
Wow. That's such an incredible story. Oh, my gosh.

[00:35:40.100] - Jesus Ramirez
 Yeah, thank you. Thank you for that. And this podcast is obviously not about me.

[00:35:43.620] - Kat Norton
I love hearing it, though. It's so cool.

[00:35:46.670] - Jesus Ramirez
 I'm going to switch it back to you. And I want to get back onto the business side because there is something really big happening right now in the US, which is TikTok might get banned. Two questions. Number one is, what are your thoughts and feelings about that? And number two is, are you starting to prepare? What's plan B?

[00:36:07.650] - Kat Norton
My business isn't really run with TikTok anymore at all. I did start there, but we started doing tracking on sales. Not much comes from TikTok to begin with. So it's not really going to impact anything. But it is good if you are a creator, if you're posting on TikTok only or editing in that app to make sure you have your videos saved down and things. If you ever did want to repurpose them. I do an omnipresence approach, so I edit everything off the app. So I already have all my videos and everything. So obviously, I don't want TikTok to go away. I love it. We have an awesome community on there. It's almost over a million people and close to a million on there. So yeah, it's really an awesome place, but we'll see what happens. 

[00:36:53.920] - Jesus Ramirez
It's wild. I just hope it stays. We won't get political on the show, but I just think that a lot of the representatives in the US are really not listening to what it seems to be what most people want. But that's just my humble opinion. So what's next for you, Kat? What's your next biggest goal? I know you mentioned the coaching, but is there anything else? Where are we going to see Miss Excel in five years? That's a five year plan.

[00:37:16.900] - Kat Norton
Listen, five years, who knows? Because everything just is so I feel like I couldn't have even predicted where I am now two years ago because things move so quickly. But short term, right now, I'm currently building out a course on AI to go under this Excel umbrella because I was thinking about it and really I help people use technology to be more efficient at work and in life. And that really does fall under that umbrella. And in pulling my audience, I was realizing there is definitely a knowledge gap going on between the current tools that are out there and how they can be using them. And I absolutely love technology, so I've been studying this for a while too. So I'm building out an AI course. My plan was AI April and then launching Mindset May and building out my Mindset membership in May. So we'll see how I can work on the timing here because I do have conferences and stuff coming up, so I am traveling quite a bit the next few weeks. But yeah, I'm really excited too to finally have a product around mindset because I've been getting asked for this for years and I wanted to make something super accessible, super affordable but packed with tons of different master classes and workshops live with me where we could talk through things.

[00:38:31.890] - Kat Norton
I get emails all the time too, like, what book should I be reading? I want to just make this toolkit of all different things that can help transform mindsets and really just get people inspired. 

[00:38:44.130] - Jesus Ramirez
What would be the perfect person to join this particular training?

[00:38:46.930] - Kat Norton
It's really anyone who's looking to work on themselves. Okay. Anyone who is sitting there right now and if you're like, You know what, Kat? I don't feel like I'm a hundred percent my highest self right now. If you're like, I feel like there's room to go and I'm willing to check out what's out there. Because I feel like a big part, too, is people don't realize there are so many different tools that we could be using. And there's so many different concepts that we could be learning to help us expand our mindset and to help us actually just feel happier every day. My entire outlook of my life has changed dramatically. And in changing that, my actual reality has since changed as well to match that. For example, when I first started working on this stuff, I was living in my childhood bedroom, my parents' house. And Mike and I literally used to sit in the trunk of his car and drive around and just eat in the trunk of the car because we were both living in our parents houses and we're like, Where do we even go around here? So we'd be eating in the trunk of the car, sitting back up to the beach.

[00:39:43.670] - Kat Norton
And we were so happy. And I was just like, because we were constantly reading books and studying all these different concepts. And then I obviously became obsessed with it, went down a rabbit hole and started studying essentially how the mind works and why we think the way we think and how we could change these things and working on things like reducing stress, confidence, reducing anxiety, things like that, and really taking my journey of the things I've done and building out a platform around it and just seeing how that changes people's lives. I've had podcast episodes where people have taken something I've said and just ran with it and changed their lives. So I'm like, what if I had something where I just take everything out of my head and put it into something where it could really help people and where they could connect with each other, too? There's going to be a whole community aspect as well because so many people are like, I want more high vibe friends, or I want people who get it, or I want people I could talk to about the cool books I'm reading, the things I'm learning.

[00:40:36.540] - Kat Norton
So I want to have a whole community aspect too, where I can connect people together.

[00:40:41.980] - Jesus Ramirez
So I've heard you say the word happiness several times in that response. What does happiness mean to you?

[00:40:46.640] - Kat Norton
Happiness is really just feeling good. And it's like a pure feeling, if that makes sense. I remember my happiness used to ride on everyone around me's happiness. I was always overthinking. I was like, I wonder how they're feeling right now. Are they mad at me? What are they doing? You know what I mean? Where for me, happiness is in the quiet, pure joy. It's in those moments where I'm just like, Wow, I'm so grateful to be here. I'm so grateful for what's happening. So much love is in my heart. As cliche as that sounds. I do a lot of gratitude practices. Every night before I go to bed, I'm thinking about what I'm grateful for. I'm also doing segment intending is a teaching from Abraham Hicks, where you can intentionally segment out your day and what you want. So essentially creating a little roadmap for a subconscious mind to go in and filter for us. I geek out on all this stuff. It's really like, happiness is that the pure joy bliss moments where you're truly in the moment, too. 

[00:41:52.940] - Jesus Ramirez
You mentioned gratitude and one of the things I started doing is I started saving emails and comments that were grateful. And not just a simple thank you, it was more like a paragraph that showed that the person really appreciated the content that I created for them. One in specific, which was really touching for me was that a gentleman reached out, emailed me, and he mentioned that he had unfortunately lost the hand to an accident, and that photography was his therapy, and that my videos were helping him with his photography. And he just wrote me this big, long message about how he was just really grateful that I put out content that he enjoyed and he could just practice his photography and his Photoshop just to help him get over the hand accident. I was like, Oh, my God. I never thought I would be helping anybody get through something like that by posting a Photoshop tutorial. And those are the messages that I've saved because I'm sure as you know, when you put stuff online, you are going to get a certain percentage of negative mean comments attacking you. And you're like, Bro, this is a Photoshop tutorial.

[00:43:06.610] - Jesus Ramirez
This is an Excel video. Why are we attacking people? And I needed to create a little folder that I could just scroll through every now and again whenever those negative feelings start taking over. It helps me stay a little grateful and motivated to just keep going. 

[00:43:24.700] - Kat Norton
Totally. I have the same thing, Testimonials folder. I was actually going through it this morning because my ad team needed new testimonials and I was going through it. I was like, Wow, that's a great idea. I had to go through this. 

[00:43:35.900] - Jesus Ramirez
Yeah, because if youjust go through the live comments, there's going to be mean ones. I don't know how you feel about this, but when I started in YouTube back in 2011, I did the mistake of arguing with people online, which is the worst thing you can do for a lot of reasons. Number one is you don't know who you're arguing with. It could be a child, it could be a 10 year old. So why am I wasting my time with a 10 year old? Clearly, that person is already having a bad day. I should just say, sorry, I'm so sad you're having a bad day because if they're having a good day, they're not going to take the time to write a mean comment to you. And also how does that make me look in front of my audience if I'm arguing with something dumb? So now, to be quite frank with you, if it's something really mean, not a criticism, because it's okay if somebody feels that I did something wrong and they have their way of doing it fair. That's fair. But if it's a plain attack, I just delete it. There's no interaction. I don't want to have that energy on me.

[00:44:35.280] - Jesus Ramirez
And you were talking about it earlier. People in situations like us, we're getting a lot more input from the world than a normal human being is designed to intake. And I just don't want to have that negativity in my space. So I just get rid of all of that. And that was one of the biggest things that I had to learn doing the type of work that I do is how much input is put on us and how much that affects us. It took me a long time to figure that out. 

[00:45:03.800] - Kat Norton
Totally it ties back to the law of polarity. I remember my friend teaching me this really early on because I was like, Oh, my gosh. I feel like I'm getting more mean comments. But then if you think about it, typically 30 % of people are going to love everything you do. No matter what. Like 30 % are just going to hate everything that you do. And then you got the population in between. And the bigger the pools grow, the more negative, the more positive. We live on a polarity planet, so these things will happen. And I just came to terms with that. And then I never give them any attention, too, because it's love attraction, where your energy goes, more of it will grow. So I always just bless them in my head because they typically need more help than I do. You're spending your day writing, stop dancing. I'm like, okay. And I try to actually send them a lot of love energetically, where I look at the comment and be like, I hope they find what they're looking for, and I hope they're able to clear out whatever. Because everyone's just seeing what you do through their own perception and through their own lens.

[00:46:09.110] - Kat Norton
And oftentimes even me just existing triggers people seeing this woman out there running a business, making money. She doesn't work that many hours. Oh, my gosh, I work so many hours and I don't make that much money. And people get these narratives in their head and then they'll spew them at me where I just kept having to learn with my energy field, if I want to keep living the life I want to create, I just have to keep being me and just not letting the things get to me and just keep working on myself because the bigger everything grows, the more people are going to do things. And everyone's just seeing it through their lens. Where I have other people who are like, Wow, I saw cat did that. That means I can do that, too. And that jumps them twenty steps. Some people will get offended by just my existence. And other people will be like, Oh, my gosh. Wow. Their subconscious mind like filed pattern. Subconscious mind will be like, Wow, Kat, she grew up in New York and she did this. I grew up in New York and I did this. Or people could find a reliability to me.

[00:47:06.040] - Kat Norton
And then they're able to go and take those next steps and get motivated and their life is changed in such a positive way. So it really just... It's one of those things where we just get to be us, do us, try our best not to let the criticism get in the way of showing up fully. That's the thing, too, because sometimes you could have the criticism in the back of your head. And then when you go to show up, you're not being fully authentically you. And then that'll impact how far the content goes in the algorithms. Because if you feel off and you're cringing, if someone's like, Oh, my gosh, your hair looks terrible. And then you get on, you look at yourself and you're like, Oh, does my hair look terrible? It's one of those things where I always get to work on that and on myself and just trying to level that up within me.

[00:47:49.660] - Jesus Ramirez
And a couple of things I want to reply to. Number one is I absolutely agree with that. I have gotten inspired so many times by other creators, not even necessarily in the Photoshop space, but in my opinion, success leaves clues. So if I see that you're doing something that's working, not to say that I'm going to go start dancing on my Photoshop videos because that's not my personality, that's not me. But maybe whether it's, I don't know, the frequency or the way that you explain for you, to be quite honest, is the energy. So for me looking at your stuff, I want to work on my energy. I'm probably going to deliver it different than you because we have different personalities, but that is one of the clues that your success has left behind that I want to pick up on. And I've done that with so many different people. And it's interesting to me, the people who look at someone like you and immediately it's like, Why is this girl making more money than me? Why is she only working these many hours? Instead of saying, All right, fine, she is making more money than me.

[00:48:45.790] - Jesus Ramirez
Let me see, what is she doing that I could apply to my life so that I can get there rather than me try to take you down. That just seems insane to me. And regarding the comments that people made, as I've mentioned four times in this podcast, I'm in YouTube forever now. I got a comment yesterday and it said something like, Oh, he's getting old or something. I was like, Oh, no. I need a better skincare routine or something because after a decade, I do look different. So yeah, you try to not let those comments get to you. 

[00:49:23.400] - Kat Norton
Totally. 

[00:49:24.150] - Jesus Ramirez
We're at the 50-minute mark, Kat, and I do want to be respectful of your time, but I do like to end the show by asking you a series of lightning round questions. These questions can be very short. It could be a one on one word to answer. It could be a whole conversation. Completely up to you. If you don't want to answer it, you can just say pass. Does that sound good? 

[00:49:45.020] - Kat Norton
Yeah, let's do it.

[00:49:45.790] - Jesus Ramirez
Awesome. So tell us a shocking fact about yourself that not many people know. 

[00:49:51.860] - Kat Norton
A shocking fact about myself. Well, I was a brown belt in karate. And it was funny because I was also taking Irish step dance at the same time. So then I was doing my karate kicks, like Irish step dance kicks. And then I was dancing Irish step dance and doing karate kicks. This is when I was younger, but I went up to Brown belt. 

[00:50:13.230] - Jesus Ramirez
That's amazing. What is the most interesting thing you've learned in the last six months? It could be professional, it could be personal. I'd say most interesting.

[00:50:21.670] - Kat Norton
Things just overall is the development of AI. That's been something that's really been rocking my world lately and seeing how different companies are going in and integrating it. And that's really what got me inspired to dive in full force and then just figure out ways that I could teach that to my audience and make it something that's approachable and humanize it a bit. The next question I have.

[00:50:41.040] - Jesus Ramirez
For you is, what would you like to be remembered for? What mark do you want to leave in the world? 

[00:50:49.520] - Kat Norton
Really inspiring people and helping people be the better version of themselves. And my goal is to, before I leave the planet, just help as many people as I possibly can and just keep growing my audience and growing my capabilities of helping people. 

[00:51:05.910] - Jesus Ramirez
Good. I had a feeling you're going to say something like that. Not surprising at all. What is the best piece of advice you've ever been given? Again, it could be personal or professional.

[00:51:18.190] - Kat Norton
My best piece of advice is don't take advice from people who you wouldn't trade places with in that area because that was something I really had to work on, especially when I first started the business. I had a bunch of people who weren't even entrepreneurs telling me how to run my business. And naturally with the hierarchies of life and people who are your elders and things, it's always important to, yes, be respectful of anybody's opinion. I always thank them. But you don't have to always run with it, especially if you wouldn't trade places with them in that area. It's always important to be respectful. But I always go in and I'm like, Okay, thank you for that. To do my thing. 

[00:51:54.420] - Jesus Ramirez
What is the worst piece of advice that somebody gave you? 

[00:51:58.080] - Kat Norton
I've had things like people who never owned a business telling me about my pricing, or even people who don't work out and are overweight telling me how to eat and how to work. And I'm just like, I can't do this right now. I'm going to listen to my trainer. 

[00:52:14.570] - Jesus Ramirez
I had someone reach out to me, again, somebody that saw me on YouTube. And at the time, this is no longer true. My website has downloadable for the tutorials that I do. They're free at the time, they were free as well. But the difference is that back then, I had this little box that said, if you enjoy the tutorial, feel free to share this on Facebook or Twitter. If you don't want to, that's fine. Just click on the X. This box will go away. You can download the image. And I thought it was clear as day. And this person reaches out to me and says, Hey, I realized that you do have that X that will make it go away, but let me give you a piece of advice. And he wrote me an essay about how businesses don't need social media to be successful. And then he went on to tell me his business accolades and how many businesses he owned or whatever. So I looked him up on LinkedIn and I found him. And a lot of the things he mentioned on the email were part of his LinkedIn, I'm assuming they were true. But he had been retired for about 10 years.

[00:53:21.810] - Jesus Ramirez
So he's giving me business advice, having been retired a decade prior. And from what I read on his profile, had zero experience with social media, which is the business that I was in. I was a content creator. So I found it to be very interesting that someone took time out of the day to tell me, you're doing this wrong and let me tell you why, and this is my resume. You should listen to me. So it's always crazy how people just feel like they need to tell you, especially people that don't know you. I'm sure your family and friends are actually trying to help, just they don't have the right context. But somebody that doesn't know you, that's super weird. 

[00:53:59.960] - Kat Norton
Totally. 

[00:54:00.660] - Jesus Ramirez
I have feeling that you're going to have the perfect answer for this one, or you may have trouble picking one. But what is your favorite quote? 

[00:54:11.480] - Kat Norton
Oh, that is a great question. I honestly can't even think of one at the moment. I'm trying to think. I feel like there's just so many. 

[00:54:18.200] - Jesus Ramirez
Well, if you think of one, let me know. What is the most difficult thing about being Kat Norton?

[00:54:23.960] - Kat Norton
I would say it's really like right now it's like figuring out where to focus my energy because I'm feeling super inspired in so many areas right now. I'm going through a period, like the business flows, and I'm going through a period where I'm just like, Oh, my gosh. I want to create like 100 new things. So really just focusing on, okay, what's the best thing for my audience right now? And this is all the time of the world to keep making more, but zoning in on a couple of things. 

[00:54:56.000] - Jesus Ramirez
Yeah, I would give the same answer. I've always thought that when you say yes to something, you're saying no to something else. And my problem is that I say yes to a lot of things. So I need to definitely start saying no to some things. What is something that people often get wrong about you? Any misconceptions about you? 

[00:55:17.630] - Kat Norton
Something I see sometimes in comments is people think I must have come from so much money or mommy and daddy gave me everything, but I was buried in student debt and did not grow up with a lot of money. So that's something where I was living in my parents' house, buried in debt. So I did start the business myself with my own money. It didn't even cost a lot of money though. It was like a $200 business. I just needed a ring light. 

[00:55:41.640] - Jesus Ramirez
Right. It was like a $200. Man, those are incredible margins. If you could master any skill, what would it be and why? It cannot be related to Excel or your work. 

[00:55:53.730] - Kat Norton
Interesting. I would say teleportation. 

[00:55:58.040] - Jesus Ramirez
That's my answer. 

[00:56:02.050] - Kat Norton
Yeah, teleportation. Because I'm always traveling and going different places. I've been living in Laguna the last couple of months, but I realized I've only been here two of the weeks because I've been just traveling so much. 

[00:56:13.580] - Jesus Ramirez
Oh, my God. Where are you going next? 

[00:56:14.340] - Kat Norton
So I'm going to Seattle for the Microsoft MVP conference at Microsoft HQ. So we're going up that way. Super excited. And then I'm going back to New York after that for a wedding. We're always just bouncing around. 

[00:56:27.860] - Jesus Ramirez
And of course I cannot end the podcast without asking you a couple Excel questions. Number one is, what is your favorite Excel feature and why? 

[00:56:38.780] - Kat Norton
Favorite Excel Feature, I would say, is the Flash Fill tool currently. It's something that consistently goes viral on social media because it is so powerful and so easy to use. 

[00:56:50.960] - Jesus Ramirez
Cool. And finally, if you could add any feature to Excel at all, what would it be and why?

[00:56:57.320] - Kat Norton
I would say, which I've been dabbling, I think there's add-ons where you could do this type of thing, but really the ability to zoom in on the ribbon and things like that while I'm teaching would be awesome. Cool. Because when I teach and share a screen, I want that whole area to be zoomed in. That'd be cool. 

[00:57:15.710] - Jesus Ramirez
Fair enough. I hope that people listening know what you're referring to because I think I said this off air, but I am so bad at Excel. And I forgot what I was doing, but I was doing some work the other day here with my business and my fiancée walks in and she looks over and she goes, Why aren't you doing that in Excel? And I'm like, I don't know how to use Excel. So yes, I am so bad. But thank you so much for joining me today, Kat. It was amazing. You have an amazing energy. I can see why you're so successful. And thank you so much for sharing your thoughts and your experiences with us. 

[00:57:51.570] - Kat Norton
Thank you for having me. This was so much fun.